Army to Review M1 Engine Upgrades

Abrams_M1A2

On orders from Congress, the U.S. Army will review whether it makes sense to upgrade the M1 Abrams tank engine with a more fuel-efficient design.

The Army has about 6,000 Abrams, the service’s main battle tank made by Falls Church, Va.-based General Dynamics Corp. Thousands of the hulking vehicles, each weighing about 70 tons, sit idle at a depot in southern California.

Army Chief of Staff Gen. Raymond Odierno last year testified that the service has plenty of tanks to respond to any global contingency and asked for permission to temporarily stop buying newly refurbished versions to fund other priorities, such as helicopters and other vehicles being heavily used in Afghanistan.

Lawmakers denied the request. Now, they’re giving the service $90 million it didn’t want for the so-called upgrade program, according to a copy of the recently approved 2014 National Defense Authorization Act, which sets policy and spending targets for the fiscal year that began Oct. 1.

The tank funding “that the Pentagon hasn’t even requested” is an example of the way in which the legislation “is out of touch with reality,” William Hartung, an author and director of the Arms & Security Project at Center for International Policy, a research organization based in Washington, D.C., said in a statement.

The bill, noting the Army and Marine Corps don’t plan to replace M1A1 or M1A2 versions of the tank, calls for the services to consider replacing “the current engine with a modern, fuel efficient power train.”

It directs Army Secretary John McHugh and Navy Secretary Ray Mabus to submit a report to the congressional defense committees by June 1 “on a business case analysis and an investment strategy” to add a modern fuel-efficient engine and transmission for the M1, according to a copy of the legislation.

About the Author

Brendan McGarry
Brendan McGarry is the managing editor of Military.com. He can be reached at brendan.mcgarry@military.com. Follow him on Twitter at @Brendan_McGarry.
  • S O

    It might actually make sense to replace the turbines in some battalions with diesel engines, but 90 million should be enough to actually replace engines in a few battalions, not just to study whether it makes sense.

    We already know there’s an export version with the EuroPowerPack (which in turn is known to be excellent).

  • Considering the M1 is now over 30 years old and built with 1970s technology perhaps it’s high time to start development of a replacement – one more mobile, less pointed at a northern European battlefield and less vulnerable to down firing anti tank warheads.

    • S O

      The U.S.Army is 100% incompetent at getting a combat vehicle developed from scratch. They didn’t get any of their many attempts into production since the Abrams/Bradley developments, and those were already riddled with bad decisions.

      • DB-1

        I guess the Stryker and all those MRAP vehicles don’t count huh?

        • Nick

          Stryker is wheeled (read in a real war of movement it’s a liability), and the MRAP is too heavy to be deployed and the marines are giving them away to cops for free. So yeah, those are good examples too of incompetence.

        • S O

          I chose my words carefully.

          MRAPs are not “combat vehicles”, but transport vehicles.
          Stryker wasn’t “developed from scratch”, as it is based on a Swiss Piranha III 8×8 vehicle.

          Look at M8 AGS, Crusader, FCS.

          The Marines bureaucracy is even worse. Their recently cancelled “EFV” was the latest incarnation of a development going back to 1973. Their LAV was based on an early Piranha vehicle.

          • “Look at M8 AGS, Crusader, FCS.” You do realize all these systems were never adopted?

            As for choosing your words carefully… “As for the h The U.S.Army is 100% incompetent at getting a combat vehicle developed from scratch.” The history of the Pershing, Patton, M113, Bradley, Abrams put a big dent in that 100% claim.

          • S O

            “You do realize all these systems were never adopted?”
            Yes, that was the point. The Army is 100% incompetent at this.

            “The history of the Pershing, Patton, M113, Bradley, Abrams put a big dent in that 100% claim. ”
            Look up grammar. “is” signifies present tense. It’s not the same as “is and always was”.
            I made clear that they failed ever since they introduced Abrams and Bradley, and that they messed up in those programs already.
            Besides, the genesis of Pershing was not exactly flattering (it took too long) and Patton had serious shortcomings (such as road range). M113 was developed more as a transport than as a combat vehicle.

            You need to focus better, as you don’t seem to comprehend simple texts.

          • DBM

            SO- The styker is 8×4 which means it gets stuck easily in soft earth.

        • tiger
          • Mambo

            Tell that to the thousands of soldiers limbs that are still attached.

          • FreeAmerica

            Thought is usually a good thing before speaking.

        • DBM

          The Stryker is a piece of crap that failed every developmental test but was accepted anyway. It was originally developed in Belgium as a battlefield taxi and not as a combat vehicle.

    • Benjamin

      It is 30 years old but is still very effective. What makes sense at this time is to look at components of the M1 and see if industry can replace them with more modern stuff. This will ease maintenance and logistics problems. An engine that gets .1 miles to the gallon more will save the Army a significant amount of money.

      • SJE

        Yep. One word: B52

    • blight_

      Top-down attack is going to be the great equalizer. It’s probable they will attach applique or ERA to the roof, and then accept anybody that isn’t buttoned up and fighting from open hatches is going to get wounded.

  • sharkey

    I wonder at the stilted point of view regarding tanks as an asset in future combat situations. If I were to enter combat anywhere with the proliferation of anti-tank anti-armor weapons which appear to be in the hands of nearly every fighting group I see in the news or on TV I’d be terrified. During WWII and other conflicts I remember reading the expected life expectancy of Tankers (crews) as being very short. What is it today? Further, with the development of drones and “lookdown shoot down” weapons do the existing tanks have any defense for that? All this coming from a submariner, me.

  • ronaldo

    I worked on a new engine program for the M-1 about 10 years ago. The objective was to have a common advanced turbine engine for both the M-1 and the new Crusader mobile 155mm gun vehicle. Of course the Crusader program was cancelled and unfortunately the common engine program went with it. I believe the selected turbine was also supplied by (now) Honeywell.

    Can any of you shed any light on this recent history ?

    • muzzledlr

      The LV100-5 engine was designed and tested for the Crusader and the M-1 between 2000 and 2004. Development was nearly complete, when the Crusader program was cancelled, then upgrading the M1A1’s was cancelled, which only left the M1A2’s to upgrade. The program was no longer cost effective. The whole program was based on the fact that the LV100 was so much more fuel efficient than the AGT1500, that the fuel savings alone would pay for the development ad production of all the engines needed. The Army can’t make up its mind if they want to keep their main battle tank.

      • ronaldo

        Many thanks Muzzledlr !

  • Bernard

    Why are we wasting money on something the Army doesn’t want? Even if you improve it’s fuel efficiency it’s still a 70 ton tracked vehicle. Supporting it on the battlefield is a huge logistical undertaking regardless of fuel needs.

  • DB-1

    To Bernard: The survival rate in IRAQ and Afghanistan wars is very impressive for Tankers if you and anyone on this Blog think Tanks are out dated. I beg to Differ ask anyone with first hand knowledge and they will tell you… or go ask an insurgent who thought like you.

  • hibeam

    I’m working on an inflatable M1-A1. It has the same carbon footprint as a hippie.

    • Howe

      hopefully you don’t use any other hippy traits, othersise the enemy will smell you coming from miles away!

    • Not possible, hippies are really dirty.

  • tmb2

    Our fleet as a whole needs to do better on fuel economy in the future. An M1 gets something like half a mile/gallon and the most heavily armored humvees get around five mpg. It’s a matter of physics that more armor= more fuel, but there are engine technologies allowing us for better fuel economy without sacrificing too much power. It’s worth the expense to explore those options. The line about “the Army didn’t want this” probably has more to do with budget priorities than anything else. The former GCV competition was to involve a hybrid drive to deal with such issues.

  • john

    Most re-engine programs pay for themselves with the fuel they save. A modern design should also be more dependable. Based on this and the reduced supply train costs for the fuel a program with these goals makes sense. A link with information would be helpful to see if this program has the same goals. Also how does this match up with the modernization program that the army is planning for this tank at the end of this decade?

    • Really?

      Really? I don’t think so.

      No “re-engine programs” can save that much fuel to pay for the cost of the replacement program. Besides, we are not facing any land war threats. We are already spending more on the military than the next 20 countries put together. All done without any real threat.

      It’s all about fattening the wallets of special interests.

  • I’m afraid if the military starts getting rid of tanks, my local police department will start using them.

    I wonder where the next war will be? Will it be on the seas with China, the plains of Europe against Russia, or the middle east? And if it’s the middle east, will the next dictator we need to take out stand by like Iraq’s Saddam Hussien and let us ship half of the US’s war inventory to the middle east UNCHALLENGED!

    Please… I just don’t think we need a lot of new tanks. Sell the to Europe and India.

    • Really?

      Really? of course not!

      Thanks to guidance of Russian field advisers, many in the ME know how to exploit the weakness of these tanks and crack them with RPG’s.

      • Most of them burning today are Russian tanks…

      • DBM

        Really(sarcasm) Ever hear if the one single M-1 we lost to enemy RPG fire in Iraq ? It broke down and was locked up and left behind by the crew. It was hit by 120 RPGs before one got a lucky hit and ignited fuel.

      • DBM

        That’s pure BS and poor quality. The only M-1 that the insurgents took out with an RPG was broken down and left behind. Took 120 RPG hits to finally set off the fuel;

  • SJE

    This actually makes sense. For every tank crew member that we save by putting them in 70 tons of armor, there are many more drivers of fuel trucks that are being killed trying to feed these beasts. The Taliban doesnt attack our M1s, but attacks the fuel convoys riding through the Khyber pass. Supply chains are the classic weak points in any protracted conflict.

    Plus, perhaps troops can actually walk behind the tanks without being fried by turbine exhaust.

    • tlp

      We refueled our track vehicles in Vietnam mainly with bladders lifted by Chinooks.

  • moondawg

    We don’t know where the next war will be and with who. We can be sure there will be a next war and it will probably be a land war. Those 7000 M1s may be invaluable. More fuel efficient ones are a win win. Addressing what the Army wants is another matter. What the Army wants isn’t always what the Army needs. The Army wants to spend tens of millions of $$ on camouflage uniforms de jour. In WWII prior to D Day, the U.S. had a heavy tank ready to go into production. The Army didn’t want it and refused it. They though the obsolete Sherman was OK. They even turned down the up gunned Sherman the Brits were using. Consequently, the German Tigers, Panthers, and up gunned MRK IVs destroyed Shermans by the thousands and we literally ran out of tank crews. by the end of 1944 we were making infantryman instant tankers. Read “Death Traps” by B.Y. Cooper, a tank officer in the 3d Armored Div.

  • Stan

    I think we had a jet engine in a tank long enough, it’s time to upgrade to a rocket engine. I figure F1 might do the trick. The tank will of course carry about 1/1000s (give or take) of a second worth of fuel but that should be enough for a 200 mile trip. Maneuvering might be an issue.

  • phil

    How about sticking a VW TDI engine in them ;-)

  • Big-Dean

    How about sticking a Toyota Prius engine in there, that way all of the tankers can then act like pious jerks ;-P

    It’ll be called the P3 (Pious Prius People) engine

  • Chuck

    Congress wants the military to put money into the main battle tank — i.e. the tip of the spear. The military wants to put money into pie-in-the-sky, overbudget aviation programs.

    Which group is out of touch with reality, again?

    • Bandit

      How many tanks have saved lives vs aviation in the last ten years?

      • They are both important. The next enemy might have MANPADS and if so you won’t be seeing a bunch of helicopters all the time.

        Like said recently, we need to get passed thinking every future conflict is going to be like the last ten years. they may be but I doubt we are going to try and rebuild any countries any time soon but we may need to react to an adversary attacking an ally or even conduct a punitive expedition.

        • DBM

          In the current conflicts we lost a ton of aircraft to RPGs and none to the non existent MANPADS. We lost more helo’s to RPG than tanks

          • Don’t be so sure we haven’t lost ANY aircraft to MANPADS. Enough said…

            This enemy doesn’t have a lot of MANPADS. Imagine one that has RPGs AND MANPADS. The current fight isn’t the only one we’ll ever see.

            Not getting the point about the focus on aviation. a diesel engine is a fraction of the cost of helicopter. What is out there to make helicopters RPG proof? Armor? Kind of heavy. APS? All the friendly fire issues and not good for rotor blades or turbine engine intakes…

      • tmb2

        In the first 18 months of OIF – A LOT. Besides, the primary purpose of the Abrams and the Apache isn’t to save lives – it’s to take the enemy’s. When we need them to do that they do it brilliantly. Saving friendly lives is a nice by-product.

  • Adam
  • As has been said by moondawg, sometimes what the Army wants isn’t what the Army needs. The M1 is an outstanding tank whose greatest shortcoming is that it uses almost as much fuel idling as it does at full speed across the battlefield. This is a fundamental reality of a turbine engine. An M1 equipped with a diesel that provides similar performance would ease a bit of the logistical tail. For a military that must deploy to the fight, this is a critical need. We cannot rely on an enemy that allows us time to build a force on the border.

  • Hunter76

    Re our last 3 semi-major wars (the 2 “Gulfs” and Afgan):

    Does anyone think they would have gone differently without the M1?

    (Does anyone else think it’s ironic that the “Gulf” wars had essentially nothing to do with the Gulf?)

    • SJE

      What? Iraq is at one end of the Gulf, had invaded one of them, and threatened other Gulf nations.

      • Hunter76

        Come on. The 1st “Gulf” War was exclusively about Kuwait and is more accurately described as the “Kuwait War” (which should include the Iraqi invasion). The other Gulf states were not explicitly threatened (though they, like the non-Gulf allies, drew their own conclusions about the threat from Iraq). The only real naval action was a feint (had to make the Cong people happy about their long-obsolete battleships). Of course, in both wars the Allies projected plenty of missiles and planes from ships, but the Gulf itself was not contested.

        The 2nd war was about Iraq (or perhaps more accurately, the desire of the Neo-cons to project Am power) and is better called the Iraq War. Iraq has almost no Gulf coastline. There was no naval action, not even a feint.

    • Benjamin

      They probably would have ended with the same result but more casualties in both of the 2 “Gulfs”. More so in the first by a factor of 2 or 3.

  • john

    http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/abrams.htm
    Info on the upgrade and saveings about halfway down

  • whoszat

    I wonder what an unmanned tank design would look like.

    What is the appropriate armor/speed/weapon balance when there are no crew to kill?
    What is the right size and geometry when there is no crew compartment or driver?

  • Big-Dean

    Hey, I’m not a tanker nor an Army dude. But from this Navy’s guy’s perspective, even though the turbine engines uses a lot of fuel, the turbine engine is one of the greatest strengths of the M1, it makes it : very fast, very low noise signature, no black smoke and generally low maintainance.

    The gas turbine engine has lots of advantages, and as you know almost the entire Navy fleet is gas turbine powered: low maintenance, quick ramp up to speed, etc.

    As for the concern that “idling” uses a lot of fuel, that’s simple, turn it off and use the APU to power electronics and a AC while your sitting. You only need to have the main engine running if you in a hot shooting situation and need to move quickly.

    • Jacob

      Well, I guess that’s why the Army is “reviewing” its options to weigh the upsides and downsides of an engine switch. Nothing’s been decided just yet.

    • As an Infantry guy with a bunch of mechanized experience the difference is when in combat the tank often can’t turn off the engine because of the amount of time it takes to get it started again. This could get you killed.

      It’s very uncommon where a ship has to fire its weapons multiple times in a day unless supporting an amphibious assaults while armored battles can go on for days with tanks having multiple engagements. Think Desert Storm or the early days of Iraq vs the last ten years where we could position bases all over Iraq (and tanks weren’t used as much).

      • Big-Dean

        Hey majOd, perhaps you can educate me a bit. The way I see it, the only time the tank needs to be moving quickly is when it’s facing other equal threats i.e. tank on tank battle, where speed, maneuver, and positioning are so importing. But in urban warfare, it you’re hit by an RPG, it doesn’t matter a lick if you moving or not, the round will have the same influence (good or bad. In urban warfare, it’s more about position and presence, and not speed nor maneuver-is that correct?

        • You are right about speed in the tactical perspective when in contact but there is also tactical out of contact situations and the operational level. Moving armor long distances quickly has its advantages. It allows you to mass armor against the enemy where it wasn’t expected it also increases the impact of exploiting penetrations or the speed of advancing getting you inside the enemy’s ability to react or even know what’s happening.

          Armor can be effective in urban warfare but it is almost exclusively a supporting arm of the Infantry. A tank’s ability to move quickly or accelerate is largely neutralized in the urban environment. Except if you’re in a tank getting hit by RPG fire that takes time to get started . That puts you at a disadvantage where ever you are

  • IronV

    Much to everyone’s surprise, the M1 distinguished itself in URBAN combat in Iraq–so much so the Army went a step further resulting in the SEP and TUSK upgrades aimed at static, urban combat. The M1 was a real life saver in Iraq. Quite literally.

    • ronaldo

      There’s lots of nits to pick with your statements, but the SEP origins had nothing to do with Iraq other than coincidence. TUSK is Iraq experience driven. But what you do not mention has nothing to do with the tank itself.

      It was the GD Armament Systems case shot. That’s right, a real 120mm shotgun with tungsten balls. The normal sabot and HE shells were worth practically nothing in the urban environment but a crash development for the case shot did make a difference.

  • Auyong Ah Meng

    Nothing beats another armoured main battle tank than having your very own…in quality and in great quantity.

    Better to have them now then “regret” not having them or sooner.

    • Hunter76

      “In great quantity” is a big rub. The M1 ate the T72s and other Sov tanks Iraq had in field. But so did helos, planes, and even much lower vehicles armed with appropriate missiles.

      Besides, where do you Tankers think we’ll fight the next major tank war? Europe is flooded with anti-tank weapons. East Asia?- S Korea is the only toehold we have on the mainland.

      Middle East?- We would be well-advised to keep out of big entanglements; let the parties there provide and pre-position their own tanks (including the Isrealis).

  • Vitsing

    The Land Warfare folks supporting GD have deep pockets and Lobbyist to get funding even if the Army does not want it. Likewise, the folks supporting UDP (M-2 et.al.) also do well with their Lobbyist.

  • The Honeywell-GE LV100-5 gas turbine was to offer improved reliability and greatly reduced fuel consumption on move and at idle. If nothing else the LV100-5 showed the capability of a new technology turbine engine.

    In Feb of 2013 the latest version of the XM360 120mm main gun hit a milestone goal of 16Mj muzzle energy. That would be a significant upgrade over the 120mm L/55 and more than the possible 140mm gun upgrade. The XM360 is also planned to be a couple tons lighter than current M256.

    Advances in lightweight composites for use in Abrams armor panels and the use of fiber optics over wire in Abrams are intended to help lower overall weight of vehicle.

    More potent main gun, improved fuel economy and reliability while keeping advantages of gas turbine, reduced weight and enhanced sensors and C3

  • Lance

    Never got why the Army if they see the performance of the Abrams slip make a new tank??? We wasted Billions on ICC GCV and JLTV while we may need a new tank. Shows Army brass don’t think past there personal pocket check books.

    I dont see a problem for a new engine as a stop gap upgrade for the Abrams. Why not we don’t need GCV scrap it upgrade the Abrams and Id say Bradley as well.

  • TonyC.

    The M1 is very thirsty and that creates the need for thin skinned logistics to support it.
    The best idea to upgrade the M1 is for to increase the fuel efficiency. The tank itself is still relevant and even though the design is 30 years old, the US adversaries still can’t counter it.

  • Tony S

    I read quite a few posts, but not all. I think everyone has missed the mark. This isn’t about making the Army do something they didn’t request or to get better fuel economy. This is about awarding a new contract to GM or Chrysler. Now that the Government has dried up on giving free money to the 2 car makers, a new way need to be invented to feed cash to the Government owned Auto Makers. Sorry Ford, you aren’t invited to this buffet!

    • I didn’t see GM or Chrysler mentioned in the story and they aren’t known for being heavy equipment engine manufacturers. If you are going to speculate Cummings would have been a better guess.

    • blight_

      Chrysler spun off its military programs a long time ago.
      For large diesels, it’s Cummins, Caterpillar…any of the manufacturers of large construction equipment would be viable competitors for the task.

      Komatsu makes engines, but clearly un-American.

  • Zspoiler

    Its just more pork . They should pay for equipment we need and pay and benefits..Not on redesigning new uniforms etc.

  • Jaime Kinkelwicz
  • CaptainDoc

    the thinking of saving money by upgrading the engines is pure nonsense. the tank is a tank at 70 tons what do you expect? fuel savings if the engine tripled the mileage would not pay for the new upgrade in 20 years. just do what the machine was designed for: a tank. it is not a Toyota or Chevrolet it is a tank. tanks get good mileage considering what they carry, what the initial weight of and what the missions are. in other word just don’t do anything to it, just use it when needed. if not needed then store them, they will not become obsolete. the tanks will only become obsolete in someone’s mind. the m1a1 and m1a2 are the best in the world(look at how many are sold to other governments)” if it works don’t fix it “. there are very few retrofits to ANY military equipment that in the end make a better piece of equipment they just upgrade some ones bank account

  • DBM

    The bottom line here is that as rare as it is the congress is right on this one. We shouldn’t have any A1’s left in the inventory. They should all be upgraded. Additionally with only one tank building facility left in America shutting its doors for 4 yrs as the army wants is the same as closing it permanently. Guess the army wants to outsource tank maintenance and building to china to save money. We already can’t build anything without them anyway.

  • Big Daddy

    Great tank, I worked with them when they were first deployed while in the 11th ACR. We could not keep up with them, we had the M113 series of vehicles. The M60s were being called Tankasorous or something like that when compared to the M1. It is a great tank for sure but does need a new powerpack without a doubt. No it’s not a perfect design but as good as it comes. The weak link is the need for fuel, if they can replace it with another engine and transmission (only 4 forward gears) that requires less fuel and retains at least the same performance the savings will pay for it and the lives not lost will be worth it. As long as we have to fight on other shores anything that will help with resupply costs of men and money is a good thing, don’t ya think?

  • Pork. Military Industrial complex up to it’s usual SOP. Then again, there may be some members in Congress who are so super smart they came up with this on their own. But I bet if you drill down to who introduced the Bill and Co-sponsors you’ll find them benefiting. All these jerk offs just throwing OUR money around to each other for personal gain. As far as they are concerned, the actual Military Benefits, if any end up being realized, are a nice addition but aren’t necessary to their end game, which is sucking the Treasury for every penny they can get. If I could only get my Representative to introduce a Bill funding my camouflage condoms R&D……

  • 45K20E4

    It’s not all about fuel economy. Remember that the turbine can run on just about any fuel that can be atomized. I always got a kick out of the label warning “Do not engage smoke generators when using jet fuel”

    Also, we saw far more failures of piston engines than we did the turbines. Durability goes a long way on the battlefield.

  • Drew

    I question the author’s numbers of 6000 M1 in the field. Considering that the Army is standing down one HBCT for the Active Component, that leaves only 174 per Active Component division (1st ID, 3rd ID, 4th ID, 1st Cav, 1st AD (just one HBCT) plus the 11th ACR. The ARNG has the 276th, 116th, 30th, 155th, 1st BCT/34th ID, as well as a few other units. Considering the total M1 fleet is 58 (56 + 2 ORF) per BCT, the number is closer to 1,300 rather 6,000 even including the prepo fleet. There were almost 6K made not 6000 actively fielded.

  • 2468bodw
  • Redleg65

    As a former Tanker (NCO) and Officer in the Artillery, we really need to maintain our M1 variant fleet of tanks. Sure we should also have a secondary lighter “Big Bore Gun” The Stryker (Very expensive) fits this need but again the Generals made a “All in One” Machine. I saw upfront Soviet models and Chinese models and while shorter and reliant on active armour, I strongly believe wars are won by maneuver and air support. Tanks have a major impact on the battlefield and Congress needs to reconsider the Artillery system (current system based on the M109) is over 55 years old. The Crusader would have helps in Afghanistan (without a doubt-tora bora) and help quick fire support for Infantry and armored units elsewhere. Air Support (Helicopters-Apaches/F-16’s/F-18’s etc) are not readily available and may never deploy, but Artillery can fire 24/7 with no weather issues. Artillery round $2k vs $800k for a cruise missile vs $80k for a Hellfire. Support the tank and Artillery and spread the love.

  • gt350

    It seems we all agree that we have a great tank, so upgrade it and have it support a new weapons system, because its old doesn’t mean its not useful , how many country’s would want a M1 as back up!

  • JJC

    A new high speed Deltic Diesel may be worth considering. Napier’s engine once had the best power/weight ratio around. 36 pistons, no cylinder heads or valves. With modern design tools, materials and diesel combustion advancements – it may outperform the turbine and have superior efficiency.

    • blight_

      Almost as intriguing as a Wankel.

      At the end of the day, it’s R&D. Wankel and Deltic will remain niche for some time…

  • W.S. Newman

    We are 17 trillion dollars in debt and they are still looking for ways to spend our money! Those tanks sitting there are not disabled or unserviceable, they are just not needed right now. Why not just let them sit there and do routine maintenance on them, as we would have to do, with a new engine or weapons system or something else? Use the savings to pay retired veterans and run hospitals for all those wounded warriors who were not lucky enough to have a “70 ton beast” to protect them. Semper Fi!

  • Peter Barker
  • There is little wrong with any government departments that is not the fault of the Congress. Those whores are so far into the arses of the defense industry they couldn’t pull out even if they wanted to. Every major decision by Congress is based on “Will it be good for me”, rather than will it be good for the nation or service.

  • Sarge

    I don’t like the way budgets (politicians) control the type of warfare we have. Tanks will be needed for the next decade, or until we build a “super laser” weapon. But then our lawmakers will be afraid to use the new weapon, and we’ll be back in the tanks. Our present fleet of M-1’s is old, and we have nothing in the budget for new ones. The only option is to provide our soldiers with a tank that is fast, up-to-date, and equipped with the latest weapons. Upgrade the tanks. When has our government ever worried about fuel cost, except to control the American people?

  • DBM

    What we need is a smaller lighter tank that is more easily transported to where its needed. We don’t need new or improved strykers.

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  • SFC 11M40J3

    I am a retired Army Platoon Sergeant and a Bradley IFV Master Gunner. During Desert Storm it pissed me off to no end that the tanks had the privilege of getting topped off during the ROM’s (Refuel on the Move). Then they would figure out how much fuel they had left, and ration the remaining amount to everyone else. When First Cavalry Division made the dash from Wadi Al Batine to VII Corps Breach (a drive longer and done faster than Patton’s relief push to Bastogne) the Bradley’s sometimes were running on fumes to the next ROM where once again the tankers got all they needed.
    We seriously need to diesel engine the M1. If it works for the Leopard and the Challenger why not the Abrams? Logistics are a bitch with out throwing in the need to pamper a prima donna vehicle.

    • DBM

      The army refused to sell Turkey M-1s because they wanted a diesel piston engine in it.
      Easier to maintain, a lot better fuel economy and deisel is a lot easier to come by than JP-4 and cheaper too.

      BTW Egypt has a ton of M-1’s produced locally under licence but have you noticed that you never seen them perform any of the population control operations? I’ve seen some M-60’s and a ton of T-55 and T-62s. They don’t have to constantly be idling to keep the batteries charged so don’t suck a lot of fuel.