Subscribe via RSS

Archives by Date
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008

See all Archives
Archives by Category
'Canes
Afghan Update
Ammo and Munitions
Armor
Around the Globe
Av Week Extra
Axe in Iraq (and Elsewhere)
Bizarro
Blimps
Blog Bidness
Body Armor Blues
Bomb Squad
Brownshoes in Action
Bubbleheads, etc.
Cammo Green
Catch the "Buzz"
Chem-Bio
Civilian Apps
Cloak and Dagger
Commandos
Comms
Contingency Ops
Cops and Robbers
Cyber-warfare
Data Diving
Defense Tech Poll
Dissent Tech
Door Kickers
Drones
DT Administrivia
Eat DT's Dust
Extra! Extra!
Eye on China
Fast Movers
FCS Watch
Fire for Effect
FOS Files
Friday Funnies
Gadgets and Gear
Going Green
Grand Ole Osprey
Ground Vehicles
Guns
Homeland Security
In the Weeds with Eric
Info War
Iraq Diary
Jarhead Jazz
JSF Watch
Just War Theories
Lasers and Ray Guns
Less-lethal
Logistics
Los Alamos and Labs
M4 Monopoly
Medic!
Mercs
Missiles
Money Money Money
Most Wanted
MRAP Edge
Net-Centric
Nukes
Old Skool
Our Shrinking Planet
Planes, Copters, Blimps
Politricks
Polmar's Perspective
Popular Mechanics
Rapid Fire
Raptor Watch
Red Team
Retro-Futuro
Robots
Roll Your Own
Sabra Tech
Ships and Subs
Snipertech
Space
Special Ops
Star Wars
Strategery
Stray Trons
Tactical Development
Terror Tech
The Deadlies
The Defense Biz
The Peoples' Site
The Sunday Paper
The Tanker Tango
The View from Av Week
Those Nutty Norks
Training and Sims
Trimble on the Case
Video Lounge
War Update
Ward'z Wonderz
You can run...

See all Archives
Newsletters

Edited by Christian Lowe | Contact

Norks Launch Missile Barrage; ICBM Fails

"North Korea test-fired at least six missiles over the Sea of Japan on Wednesday morning, including an intercontinental ballistic missile that apparently failed or was aborted 42 seconds after it was launched," the Times is reporting.

Of the launchings, intelligence officials focused most of their attention on the intercontinental missile, called the Taepodong 2, which American spy satellites have been watching on a remote launching pad for more than a month.

It is designed to be capable of reaching Alaska, and perhaps the West Coast of the United States, but American officials who tracked its launching said it fell into the Sea of Japan before its first stage burned out.

"The Taepodong obviously was a failure — that tells you something about capabilities," Stephen Hadley, President Bush's national security adviser, told reporters in a phone call on Tuesday evening in Washington...

The other missiles that the North fired appeared to be a mix of short-range Scud-C missiles and intermediate-range Rodong missiles, of the kind that the North has sold to Iran, Pakistan and other nations. Those missiles also landed in the Sea of Japan...

Intelligence from American satellite photographs indicated in mid-June that the North was proceeding with the test-firing of the Taepodong 2 at a launching pad on North Korea's remote east coast. Satellite photographs showed that the North Koreans had taken steps to put fuel into the missile, but the missile sat there until Wednesday morning, leading to speculation [especially on this site -- ed.] that the North was simply staging the event in order to gain attention from the United States...

But the North contradicted expert opinion by launching its long-range missile in predawn darkness today.

The surprise launch is bad news for Pyongyang, Joe Cirincione says over at Arms Control Wonk HQ.

The North Koreans have now blown it by actually testing a system that was always worth much more as a bargaining chip than as a military capability. Continued attempts to hype the threat (by either the DPRK or the Missile Defense Agency) will now be much harder to make with a straight face... [And] all those reporters and analysts who have been talking about both the North Korean missiles and the US anti-missiles as if both were proven capabilities should slap themselves in the face and snap out of it.

UPDATE 07/05/06 12:26 AM: David here. Missile defense expert Philip Coyle from the Center for Defense Information just emailed me with this:

I'm sure you noticed that the press has been confused about how many missiles North Korea actually fired. At first it was three, then four or five, then six. But the Yonhap news agency in South Korea says North Korea fired 10 missiles, not six. At the time of Tony Snow's press briefing with National Security Advisor Steve Hadley, the White House thought only three had been fired.

And at this writing Northern Command will only confirm six. So maybe our military has been confused too.

This displays one of the vulnerabilities of missile defense. If you don't see all of the missiles an enemy fires, or if they fire too many, even the most futuristic missile defenses we can imagine will be overwhelmed.

And by coordinating its missile launches with the U.S. shuttle launch, North Korea showed that any country can aspire to have the capability to conduct peaceful space launches.

David again. Just to clarify on Phil's behalf, that last comment about "peaceful space launches" was intended as sarcasm.

UPDATE 08:03 AM: The Norks just fired off another one.

UPDATE 09:12 AM: For a completely different view, check out what Stratfor has to say: "A failed launch may ultimately offer North Korea greater choices than other scenarios might have."

Had Pyongyang succeeded, even Seoul might have thought twice about continued economic contacts with the North. And had the United States or Japan shot the missile down, Pyongyang would very quickly have been forced to decide whether to consider the move an act of war and launch a counterstrike, or just complain loudly and demonstrate its own impotence. A failed test, if a test was to be carried out, provides renewed avenues for negotiation.

China will be the first to offer its services in figuring out what next for North Korea. Pyongyang will be more beholden to Beijing following the test, as North Korea tries to gauge its options and how best to play down the failure. It has lost its missile leverage now, and will need its northern neighbor even more. For its part, China will take this added leverage with the North for its own negotiations with the United States.

The failed launch may bring Washington back into the six-party talks or to the informal six-party talks Beijing recently suggested as U.S. officials breathe a collective sigh of relief at not having been forced to decide whether to try to shoot down the North Korean missile. Thus, Washington can say it was ready for the launch without having had to prove its anti-missile system in a real-life situation. And the United States also enjoys the advantage of a North Korea weakened for now by the failed test.

The question now is what happens inside Pyongyang. A failure of a major economic, political and military expenditure could quickly lead to infighting as blame is assigned and passed and next steps are debated. While North Korean leader Kim Jong Il has shown himself quite adept at managing his place in power, the loss of a key political lever is sure to create at least a brief internal political crisis. While the North may have already thought through the implications of failure, thinking and facing reality are rather different. If Pyongyang makes quick, clear steps in the coming days, it will suggest it was either well-prepared for failure or aborted the launch itself. If not, expect to see the North close in on itself, and perhaps turn to neighbor China for advice and protection.

Either way, a major shift in North Korean behavior can be expected in the coming months.

Comments

You can choose your favourite Lineden. You can easily begin selling it to buy second life linden other residents.

Posted by: buy second life linden at August 20, 2008 01:14 AM


At last I tell you that a web site http://www.gameim.com offers very cheap SL linden.

Posted by: cheap SL linden at August 20, 2008 01:14 AM


If you want to Buy metin2 gold you can go to the company. I hope that we will become good friends in the Cheap metin2 gold game.

Posted by: Cheap metin2 gold at August 20, 2008 01:13 AM


Now I tell you that a web site http://www.gameim.com supply Cheap metin2 gold and Cheap metin2 yang.

Posted by: Cheap metin2 yang at August 20, 2008 01:13 AM


Of course the Metin2 yang can bring funs. I believed that you will love this Metin2 gold new game.

Posted by: Metin2 yang at August 20, 2008 01:06 AM


Came to the front of the nuns, Hung servant servant's face reminds me once-na infants charming face,Gangxiang opening nuns mabinogi money can be more certain, but she points outside the city said to me, time is running short, can no longer fast ? Exhausted all their strength, I believe God Min ordinary people of faith, finish the first day of the last two points, full of hope that the return to the front of Kelisite, TU why her experience is not only to give money I would like to buy mabinogi gold, but not to me!

Posted by: mabinogi gold at August 8, 2008 12:14 AM


Because there were many people asked me that borrow some cronous gold to buy medicine.

Posted by: cronous gold at August 5, 2008 11:34 PM


My friends in order to help me, send me much Requiem gold, I was very thank him.

Posted by: Requiem gold at August 5, 2008 11:33 PM


nice to meet you

Posted by: wowpowerleveling at April 14, 2008 08:00 PM


Hey Bob:

I'm more than willing to eat crow (or shoe or whatever) about the "hoax" series of comments. Check out the mea culpas below.

But, just so we're clear, I never wrote that "the administration's claims that N.Korea was preparing to perform missile tests was a world-class hoax," as you say. Instead, I suggested that the hoax was *Pyongyang's*, not Washington's. A big difference, no?

Anyway, here are my exact words:

"By the beginning of this week, it became clear that a world-class hoax had gone down. Either Pyongyang had hoodwinked the globe into thinking it was about to launch -- or the Times was once again hyping up a national security threat."

I'm not saying they were spot-on -- they weren't. But they also weren't the accusations that you imply.


Best,


nms

Posted by: Noah Shachtman at July 6, 2006 11:11 AM


I'm wonderfully amused that just a few days ago this site claimed that the administration's claims that N.Korea was preparing to perform missile tests was a world-class hoax. Now that the missile tests have been performed comments focus on the administrations presumed failure to know with certainty how many missiles were fired. I liked the comment from one poster saying that nobody was surprised by the tests - given that you claimed the warnings were a world-class hoax and that the tests weren't actually going to happen I imagine that this site's contributors were actually very surprised.

Posted by: Bob at July 5, 2006 04:15 PM


All word on the Typeofdong-2 is that it failed, not that it was aborted. I'm pretty sure if it were and abort the NORK's would be screaming that it were so quite loudly, becuase their foreign policy relies on people thinking they have an ICBM, not a pipe-dream.

As for not being able to track all the launches, we detected and tracked a missile launch that lasted under a minute on no warning hundreds of miles away? Sounds like a good job to me.

Posted by: Moose at July 5, 2006 03:52 PM


I would call it a win because they didn’t try the system by throwing one of those 6or so missiles over Japan into the Aegis BMD range or further towards either Hawaii or Alaska. If they had and we either didn’t act or failed then the Norks would have had the trump card to go into negotiations on the strong side so the motivation was their, if they had the confidence to try.

But I still think (no proof either way) the Norks blinked and hit the self destruct. If it was a pure failure of the missile then well they didn’t blink my assumption is wrong and it was just pure incompetence on the Norks. I don’t buy the failure quite yet thou. The half hearted show looked more like a face saving move by firing off, yet at the same time not risking losing the whole missile threat on a possible BMD intercept while still not pissing anyone off to much by just throwing them right off the coast of Norkland.

That is a major part of the BMD to begin with. If we can just make our enemies believe it may work nations wont spend millions on missiles that are useless against the US and her allies. Rogue states don’t waste millions upon millions on longe range bombers not because they don’t want them or would love to bomb the US its because they believe the US air force would easily take them out at nill to 0 cost. That air force capability cost US billions of dollars and decades to achieve.

Posted by: C-Low at July 5, 2006 01:38 PM


Good Morning Folks,

Oh goody the North Koreans did it, still are according to an AP wire story the A.M., and the world didn't come to an end.

I guess the story that is trying to bury itself here is, how many missiles were launched, 3,6, 7,10 still launching? and how long did Taepongdo-2 stay up, 35, 40, 42 sec. how long?

Since this event was anything but a surprise and every spy in the sky was watching how come we don't know many were launched and from where?

I guess it's time for SSN Jimmy Carter to start doing some bottom scratching in the Sea of Japan.

Meanwhile this show just how much respect Sec. of State Mzzz... Condoleezza has around the world. I assume Noah that whie this was happening she was out "Shoe Shopping" over on 5th. Ave.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

Posted by: Byron Skinner at July 5, 2006 12:55 PM


I watched the various reports as they came in and I have a problem with the narrative.

http://cernigsnewshog.blogspot.com/2006/07/4th-of-july-damb-squib.html

Look. Every single other missile was a shorter range Rodong-1 (a Scud copy). The Pentagon and the Japanese at first seemed confident the failed launch wasn't a Taepongdo-2. Then some faceless guy from State pops up and says it was - and everyone else scurries to get "on message". Color me sceptical.

Where's the proof the only missile that failed is the one that all the fearmongering has been about? Without that hard proof, I will take the Occam's Razor explanation - it was another Scud copy that just happened to fail on takeoff. The administration then decided to make political hay while the sun shines and the Pentagon and Japanese for a while got caught behind the story curve. It fits not only the events of yesterday but also this administration's history.

It amazes me that the invertebrate press corps, having been lied to over Iraqi WMD intelligence and so much more, goes on blithely presenting this administration as being trustable when it says anything at all. They should be picking at the gaps in the administration's storyline and demanding explanations. Instead they will take the administration at its belated word.

Regards, Cernig

Posted by: Cernig at July 5, 2006 12:32 PM


C-Low:

I'm assuming Phil Coyle's "peaceful" comment is pure sarcasm... I'll ask Axe, who did the interview.

Re: shoe. It's yummy. I love it. And I've saved a slice for those people who were wailing that the Norks were about to be able to hit us with an ICBM.

Also, maybe I'm being thick, but I don't get how this is a "win" for BMD.

nms

Posted by: Noah Shachtman at July 5, 2006 12:12 PM


Ohh and by the way on the # of missiles launched confusion. I wouldn’t read to much into that after all those are just different news reports at different times in the middle of more and more launches. And besides I don’t think our military should be out front giving away our technical abilities for what so CNN and S Korea News will jive?

Then our incompetent resources did flag a missile test over a week prior of. And no we didn’t get much credit for it either the same old names just like the mixed Missile number reports were picking it apart.


All in all I would call it a good day for the US and BMD. That is one point many opposing never understood even if the BMD don’t work but we can give reasonable impression it does then our enemies wont try it. The whole idea is to deter the Rogue State with a handful of nuke missiles.

Makes that all powerful “Diplomacy” some see as the beat all in its self, actually work. It is always better in negotiation to have the deck stacked in your favor. Is it fair NO, is it nice NO, but is it the surest way to win YES, does anyone really want to risk losing with millions of lives on the line I hope NOT.

Posted by: C-Low at July 5, 2006 10:47 AM


I think the Norks blinked and hit the self-destruct button. If they had gone with the missile and BMD took it down it would have instantly ended their missile threat and at the same time sent Japan, S. Korea, the world begging full tilt boogie to get under the US BMD umbrella. A live enemy fired missile intercept would have cemented BMD and if we could hit the long range the mid-ranges would have been proven useless as-well.

This way they save face by not backing down, don’t piss no one off too much since they all landed right off the coast, and most importantly none were allowed to go out far enough to possible get pinged by the BMD resulting in total disaster. Note even those mid-range missiles could have over flown Japan but they all fell right off the Nork coast. Hmmm. That says to me either the Norks are going backwards in capability or they blinked.

http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/dprk/longrange.GIF

This map shows circle ranges of Nork missiles. Note short range crosses Japan aka our BMD line. It really is too bad they didn’t range our BMD what a coup on the fourth of all days to pull a success for a controversial world changing system like the BMD if proven successful will be.

And “Peaceful space launch” was that a ping to Iran, sarcasm, or just old LLL “US is real bad guy while our enemies are really not bad at all just victims of US” retardation. I would hope Sarcasm.

By the way Noah how does that shoe taste?

Posted by: C-Low at July 5, 2006 10:25 AM


Washington DC--Yesterday, a large number of Korean missiles were fired into the air. Reports indicate most of them exploded above US population centers.

John Smith, of New York City, said "My God, I couldn't believe it. There were these huge explosions, and fire rained down from the sky. My dog hid under the couch, and my 2 year old son began crying. I just didn't know what to do."

Some casualties have been reported. Lee Roy Johnson, of Jackson Hole, Mississippi, was critically injured by one of the missiles. "He saw one of them miss-iles come down to the ground. It hadn't blown up, and he said 'I'll be derned if I let good money go to waste,'" said his wife, Jolene. "He walked over to it, kicked it, and said it was a dud. Then he bent down with his cigarette lighter and tried to get it goin'. The blame thing blowed up right in his face. He was a screamin' and a hootin' and hollerin'. I looked at my boy Jethro and said 'Look at yer pappy. Them Koreans did this to him.'"

Fortunately, injuries appear to be light. Most of the missiles appear to have exploded in mid-air, sparing the country from any serious damage, though grassfires were reported over drier states.

"We thought the Russians were dangerous," said General "Thunderbolt" Ross. "Yeah, they had nukes, but we never imagined how many missiles those funny little people in Korea could manufacture. They've made millions of them. MILLIONS. And, they've demonstrated the capabilities to get these weapons to American soil."

Known defense blogger Noah Schactman notes "This is another indication of wasted defense dollars. We've spent billions on an anti-ballistic missile program, and yet Korea was able to get literally millions of these rockets into our airspace. These things never showed up on radar, and our waste of money program never got to fire even a single shot. We are defenseless, and this "Star Wars" program has been a failure from the start. Obviously, they were just toying with us yesterday. I'm told some of the missiles even exploded into the shape of a giant American flag. They're mocking our 4th of July holiday, showing that our so-called 'free' nation is defenseless before their military might."

Posted by: Brian at July 5, 2006 09:33 AM


I think Noah's being ironic about the "peaceful space program," bro. Remember these clowns were claiming they were trying to launch a satellite back in 1998 instead of failing to have a ballistic missile test.

I mean, yeah, they'd probably love to put a satellite up but that would be even further out of their league...

Posted by: mike at July 5, 2006 09:02 AM


Evan:

Sure do!


nms

Posted by: Noah Shachtman at July 5, 2006 08:08 AM


There's always the possibility that the taepodong was self-destructed...it doesn't seem to be in NK's current persona, but perhaps they were attempting to mask their true capabilities.


The taepodong's initial stage oxidizes a gasoline/kerosene mix, which seems to typically be a more stable platform than other fuels, as that mix is in liquid state at room temperature. Liquid oxygen (or the standard russian ak-27I, in this case), is of course quite corrosive, and highly volatile.


If globalsec is accurate, this thing does seem to have more than enough thrust to send a payload to US shores: http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/dprk/td-2-specs.htm

Posted by: David at July 5, 2006 07:42 AM


I'm at a loss trying to understand the "peaceful space program" spin I'm seeing on this site. The NORKs are threatening to "annihilate" us and yet you're trying to put a "peaceful purposes" cast to their activities.

Who is paying your bills these days that you're trying to twist reality so hard?

Posted by: michael at July 4, 2006 11:55 PM


lol...yeah they should of just let it keep collecting dust on the pad...Now everyone knows how far behind there missile tech really is.

Clearly they launched it at an hour that they hoped no one would be watching, if it was a success...they would no doubt be bragging that they shot there first missile capable of hitting the US, On our nations birthday.

BTW, defensetech...I did notice how you managed to still bash the US ABM program, even when these test had nothing to do with it. "rolls eyes"

Posted by: Murc at July 4, 2006 11:32 PM


I bet you feel silly about those posts claiming hoax now :>

Posted by: Evan at July 4, 2006 11:27 PM


i honestly think that north korea is just trying to scare many americans by pulling this stunt on July 4th. they need to be put away now!!! the longer we wait the bigger the war will be!
kolin Koehl

Posted by: Kolin Koehl at July 4, 2006 11:04 PM


Post a comment




Remember Me?


Please enter the code as seen in the image below to post your comment.