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Actually I think he meant ME, Max when sglover said-

"Don't trust him. It speaks volumes that an unhinged ignoramus like Max, here, is pretty much the only person who believes him."

Actually I am very happy the Christian doesn't edit or interpret what MNF sends out-unlike THE REST of the media. Which "interpets" military statments looking for blood to boost ratings or readership. As for unhinged-only you Mr Glover and Grandjester seem to be unhinged.

As for the military guys-I am happy they are doing their best to get us info in a rough situation. I know people in Iraq, am a veteran of the war and trust them, Christian and our military - FAR- FAR-FAR more than I trust you.

Posted by: The other max at July 11, 2007 05:40 PM

I never said that I swallow whole everything that the government says, did I? I was only trying to make the point that trying to make the government into a liar every time their lips are moving is going overboard. You always have to take anything that is said by anyone, especially by those on the political left, with a grain of salt and a lot of other information to balance it all out. Trying to set up anyone who listens to the word of a government spokesman as a gullible lemming is the tactic of those with a leftist political axe to grind while a Republican is in the White House. Now if Hillary Clinton or one of your favorite Dems were president, would you have the same degree of skepticism of the word of the government?

Posted by: Max at July 7, 2007 11:05 PM

On the credibility of American military press releases (available at http://www.examiner.com/a-815250~U_S__eagerness_shows_in_dismantling_al_Qaeda.html):

"The U.S. command in Baghdad this week ballyhooed the killing of a key al Qaeda leader but later admitted that the military had declared him dead a year ago.

A military spokesman acknowledged the mistake after it was called to his attention by The Examiner. He said public affairs officers will be more careful in announcing significant kills.

The incident shows the eagerness of the command to show progress in dismantling al Qaeda at a time when Democrats and some Republicans are pressing President Bush to withdraw troops from Iraq. Army Gen. David Petraeus, the top U.S. commander, has declared al Qaeda enemy No. 1 in Iraq.

Brig. Gen. Kevin Bergner began his Monday news conference with a list of top insurgents either killed or captured in recent operations. He said they had been eliminated "in the past few weeks" and were "recent results."

Christian regularly passes on, verbatim, Pentagon twaddle. He's a shill, a stenographer. He's trashed any claim to trust he might have once had. Don't trust him. It speaks volumes that an unhinged ignoramus like Max, here, is pretty much the only person who believes him.

By the way, the example I cited sure looks like an instance where my government, or at least important parts of it, very definitely DID try to lie to me. And this is just a piddling example.

Posted by: sglover at July 6, 2007 04:38 PM

In short: unlike most places in the world, your government is not TRYING to lie to you. They may get stuff wrong, emphasize the wrong things etc. but they aren't fabricating evidence to intentionally mislead the American people.

To be honest, I don't give a damn whether the misinformation is deliberate or accidental. It's happening, though, isn't it (WMDs, for example)? And so, when I see a story entirely sourced to a MNF-I spokesman, I get suspicious. Single source is never your friend - neither in journalism nor in intelligence.

Posted by: ajay at July 6, 2007 10:42 AM

Is the casual observer of military and political affairs in the US so caught up in partisan bumbersticker assertions and gotcha journalism that he/she cannot view any subject without reflexive hysteria? In short: unlike most places in the world, your government is not TRYING to lie to you. They may get stuff wrong, emphasize the wrong things etc. but they aren't fabricating evidence to intentionally mislead the American people. By all means question the evidence, test assertions and so forth but let's leave the goofy conspiracy theories to Rosie O'Donnel shall we?

Posted by: lucabrazi at July 6, 2007 10:28 AM

Posts like this are the reason all the readership of this blog went over to wired.com

stop being part of the d.c. echo chamber.

you do a disservice to our counterterrorism efforts.

Posted by: Hubris Sonic at July 6, 2007 04:49 AM

It's interesting to see the crazies who now frequent the DefenseTech comments.

Aren't there already nutjob truther websites specifically designed for these people? I guess they imagine they are trying to counter the militant nationalism of sites like DefenseTech, but I'm no expert on delusional thinking.

Posted by: jim at July 5, 2007 03:57 PM

As b noted, this is simply repeating the claims made by a military spokesman without any independent evidence.

All very well, but by the same token you'd have top believe iranian claims about the British Navy inading their waters.

"How can anyone doubt that Iran us up to no good in Iraq..?" - quite easily. We still haven;t seen evidence that Iran is behind the equipping or insurgents etc.

Posted by: Wembley at July 5, 2007 01:42 PM

O yes, and don't forget that George Bush set explosives off in the World Trade Center to make sure it would be knocked down, so that he could pursue an evil war of aggression (blah, blah, blah)...!
I'm so tired of this inveterate skepticism of anything that the military says or that the government says. I understand very well that the government has lied about some things at one time or another, and that they can't always be trusted to tell the whole story; there is no question about that. I just have a problem with casting every word that comes from the Military or the government as automatic propaganda or lies. Liberals in particular seem to be unable to see any evil in any country except their own country, America. "Blame America First"; that's the way it always works with some people.
How in the world can anyone doubt that Iran is up to no good in Iraq through the reported use of their special forces and training and equipping of insurgents is beyond me. Their history of state sponsorship of terrorism is decades-long and well documented.

Posted by: Max at July 5, 2007 10:29 AM

"held a press conference on the heels of the Associated Press and CNN stories on the capture of a key Hezbollah special operations commander"

Well, the spokesmen who held the press conference was the primary SOURCE for AP and CNN story. This whole story is told by MFN-I and by nobody else.

This is like Judith Miller being secretly fed propaganda about aluminium tubes and Cheney and Rice citing her NYT piece as proof for their claims.

Again the MNF-I is the SOLE SOURCE of the story.

Like the "aluminium tubes", this story does not make much sense.

For starters:
Why has MNF-I been sitting on the "damning papers" for 3 month?
Why would someone from Lebanon been needed as "inbetween" Iran and Iraq. There are certainly thousands of Iranians who could pass as Iraqi any day (plus the Iraqi Badr force which has been living and trained in Iran for decades.)
Why does someone "suddenly" talk after three month of "interogation"?

Until some three weeks ago the Brig.Gen. chief spokesman was special assistent in the White House. They serve lots of Kool-Aid there.

But there is no reason for us to drink this.

Posted by: b at July 5, 2007 08:47 AM